 | Date Posted: 11/25/2009
Posted By: Ben Warren
Member Since: 3/18/2008
Number of Replies: 32
Last Post: 1/12/2010 |
| | I'm so bored....so let's start up another highly debatable topic! | Health Care: Yay or Nay?
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| Date Posted: 11/25/2009
Posted By: Ben Warren
Member Since: 3/18/2008
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| I'd also like to know your reasonings behind choosing yes or no.
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 | Date Posted: 11/26/2009
Posted By: Matthew Ratz
Member Since: 2/29/2008
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| Yay, for two reasons at the moment.
Right now I pay roughly $800 a month to insure the wife and kids.... Hopefully a public option will be competative and drive the costs down.
Secondly. (This needs to be prefaced with I am totally against social programs that help people who refuse to help themselves... welfare and what not.) But, according to reports I have heard. People without health insurance simply go to the emergency room for EVERYTHING be it a cold or the flu or what not. And when they are unable to pay the bill, Tax payers pay it for them. Now, from what I have heard... The Health care bill would help faciliate an overall lowering of these expenditures (by insuring these people). Thus, in theory, lowering my taxes.
And the argument that a government beaurocrat inbetween you and your doctor is ridiculous as there is already an insurance employee in that exact spot. So the process is virtually the same... just hopefully cheaper. (in case someone wanted to make that argument....)
Playing to Win is Playing for Fun - Matthew Ratz |
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 | Date Posted: 11/26/2009
Posted By: Jeremy Banks
Member Since: 5/3/2008
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| Agree with Ratz. Simply put.
“Great losses often bring only a numb shock. To truly plunge a victim into misery, you must overwhelm him with many small sufferings.” - Ratadrabik of Urborg |
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| Date Posted: 11/26/2009
Posted By: Ben Warren
Member Since: 3/18/2008
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| The only bad thing that I see out of this is that we are going to get taxed more(for 10 years I believe) and we aren't going to be able to use that government option until 2014. So basically we start getting taxed as soon as it is passed, and then in 2014 we can take advantage of it. And ohhhhh the lines.....
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 | Date Posted: 11/26/2009
Posted By: Travis Peifer
Joined before August '08
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| Government health care, (hahaha) whats next a implantable microchip. Oh wait thats actually real. Do any of you remember the word Tyranny, you know that thing our founding fathers fought against 200+ years ago, well guess what it's back. I'm not a docter so i don't really know that much about healthcare, so here is one. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=foXQbmZxWYY
Hampton: "Can you read, my son?" Bubbles: "Well, that depends, can you go fuck yourself?" |
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| Ahh, this should prove entertaining!
The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently. - Friedrich Nietzsche |
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| Date Posted: 11/27/2009
Posted By: Matthew Ratz
Member Since: 2/29/2008
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| Travis, I have said it before and I will say it again. You are far to young to be so irrationally paranoid.
I like Ron Paul a lot. And I think I agree with the entirety of this video. The problem is that while his views are ideal and would ultimately be, in my opinion great. These views aren't realistic. Because the corporations pay the congressmen. so the congress acts in the best interest of those "individuals" and not in the interest of the people. So (I'm hoping) that while in a perfect world maybe Ron's way would be the way to go. The government plan will be the lesser of two evils. And save me money.
Playing to Win is Playing for Fun - Matthew Ratz |
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| Date Posted: 11/27/2009
Posted By: Travis Peifer
Joined before August '08
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| The PATRIOT Act, Military Commisions act,PPD 51, these are the things everyone should read up on. I am not paranoid just because I don't trust the government. Do you really think the corporations aren't going to be making bukko bucks off the healthcare bill. I am not focused on the frontmen i.e. Bush, Obama my crosshairs are on their masters. The Fed,CFR,Trillatral Commision, ect. I agree i am too young too be involved with all this, but the duty to defend liberty is not for the old only. Why is it always the choice of the less evil, it is still evil it's kinda like choosing between hitler and stalin. Whether or not anyone wants to believe it, this is the beginning of something that will determine if we are to be slaves or freemen. I have no doubt that eventually it will come to the force of arms and i prepare to be ready. Don't think for a second it can 't happen here. We are no different than any other nation in history, we are not special like the gov and media spews. It can and is happening in this country, whether you wish to see it is up to you. You call it paranoia i call it eternal vigilance.
Hampton: "Can you read, my son?" Bubbles: "Well, that depends, can you go fuck yourself?" |
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| Yay.
"True glory consists in doing what deserves to be written; in writing what deserves to be read." - Pliny the Elder |
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| Yay.
The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently. - Friedrich Nietzsche |
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| Date Posted: 11/29/2009
Posted By: The Mike Dale
Member Since: 5/31/2009
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| Well said, travis.
" We are 5 days away from fundamentaly transforming the united states of america " - Barrack Obama |
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 | Date Posted: 11/29/2009
Posted By: Zack Strait
Member Since: 4/9/2008
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| Derp, random hate on people, babies with aids, derp.
"The shit look like ya hand when you be doin a shadow puppet for a duck n shit nahmean. Shit be lookin like it jus caught a pop fly in center field n whatever whatever nahmean." re: Ghostface Killa on lil' kim's vagina. |
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| Date Posted: 11/30/2009
Posted By: Matthew Ratz
Member Since: 2/29/2008
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| Now see Travis.... You say things like that and I mostly agree. But that Travis doesn't seem like the same Travis who has nazi-esque "Obama Youth" pictures and wears 9/11 was a governement conspiracy t-shirts....
Playing to Win is Playing for Fun - Matthew Ratz |
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| Date Posted: 11/30/2009
Posted By: Ben Warren
Member Since: 3/18/2008
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| I do have to say that a lot of the debt in America today has to do with healthcare because of emergency room visits when you don't have health insurance. A friend of mine just got "sued" the other day because of his unpaid medical bills. One thing this bill seems to insure is that everyone will be medically debt free in a few years. Especially the kids coming out of college. That seems like a really good thing for America. However, I do believe government needs to stay the hell out of our private lives, and I believe healthcare touches on that line a little too much. If the government wants to rid America of it's debt, make college free. The majority of people that graduate college have a ton of student loans that they have to pay off. I say free college before free healthcare. But wait, the government does want the general populous to actually know whats going on, so making them smarter would probably be a bad thing for them.
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| Date Posted: 11/30/2009
Posted By: Ben Warren
Member Since: 3/18/2008
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| and that last line should be doesn't*, not does.
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| Date Posted: 11/30/2009
Posted By: Ben Warren
Member Since: 3/18/2008
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| We need to find someway for the government to just be like: All preexisting loans, bills, etc. are wiped off your record. No debt for everyone! Too bad they own the car companies, and now healthcare, and the banks. Well, I seem to think that if the government didn't spend all that money, we'd be ok.
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| Date Posted: 11/30/2009
Posted By: Ben Warren
Member Since: 3/18/2008
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| It's a shame they have to buy up all of out property to give something back to China as a return for that money they gave us.
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| Date Posted: 11/30/2009
Posted By: Ben Warren
Member Since: 3/18/2008
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| all of our*
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| Date Posted: 11/30/2009
Posted By: Matthew Ratz
Member Since: 2/29/2008
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| *I use the ubiquitous "You" in reference to the reader.... not someone in particular.
We don't need free college. College is already super cheap and easily accesible. If you think otherwise you haven't looked into it. Maybe the College you want isn't, but we can't all go to Harvard.
College Loans should not be a problem as you have till forever to pay them off. You also get a year+ to even start paying on them. AND if you go back to school you get to stop paying on them until you are done again. and college should* get you a job. albeit in the current environment it may be a little more difficult.
I don't know anywhere where someone would say don't educate (Well, maybe the Discovery Institute).... A smarter nation is a richer nation.
And China didn't make the problem. They make shitty products that become a problem, but not the financial crisis. We could even go so far as to say the irrisponsible banking practices that destroyed the financial system isn't the true problem. The problem comes down to "We The People." who thought we needed a 12000 sq foot house on our 15k a year salary. Or our 60k balance spread across 5 credit cards. American dream right? I should get stuff even though I don't deserve any of it.
And I certainly agree that putting corporate preference over the populace is horrid. But in reality what are you missing in your life that you feel you don't get because of some governmental injustice? Me? I hate paying for irresponsible poor people. That's about it.
Playing to Win is Playing for Fun - Matthew Ratz |
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| Date Posted: 12/2/2009
Posted By: Travis Peifer
Joined before August '08
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| Our current economic problem is that we pay a bank to print our currency. I never thought a quote would ring this true but it seems to apply to this day and age we are living in. "I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around [the banks] will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs." - Thomas Jefferson
Hampton: "Can you read, my son?" Bubbles: "Well, that depends, can you go fuck yourself?" |
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| Date Posted: 12/2/2009
Posted By: Matthew Ratz
Member Since: 2/29/2008
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| Ok, so how do we issue money?
Playing to Win is Playing for Fun - Matthew Ratz |
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| Date Posted: 12/2/2009
Posted By: Ben Warren
Member Since: 3/18/2008
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| I'm pretty sure we're going to have to dissolve the current financial institutions to do so, and it would create a whole new currency.
Ever played at an arcade before? Credits for everyone!
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| Date Posted: 12/2/2009
Posted By: Ben Warren
Member Since: 3/18/2008
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| Sorry. Credits is too generic. I think ObamaBucks sounds better.
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| Date Posted: 12/5/2009
Posted By: Travis Peifer
Joined before August '08
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| You get rid of the "federal" reserve system and return the power to the U.S. treasury. They are trying to issue a global currency that would be digital not physical.
Hampton: "Can you read, my son?" Bubbles: "Well, that depends, can you go fuck yourself?" |
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| Date Posted: 12/5/2009
Posted By: Matthew Ratz
Member Since: 2/29/2008
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| What makes the treasury better than the FED? Who is "They" And what is wrong with a global currecy and/or the problem with digital vs physical?
Playing to Win is Playing for Fun - Matthew Ratz |
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| Date Posted: 12/8/2009
Posted By: Travis Peifer
Joined before August '08
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| Problem with the Fed
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dmPchuXIXQ
As for the problem of a global digital currency, uh nothing if your an atheist, but if your one of those crazy people who worship a "magical being" named GOD, hows eternal damnation work for ya. Can everyone say Mark of the Beast. By the way, i'm done trying to convince everyone on whats really going on. All i am gonna say if you think this is the end of the crisis, its just the beginning.
Hampton: "Can you read, my son?" Bubbles: "Well, that depends, can you go fuck yourself?" |
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| Date Posted: 12/8/2009
Posted By: Matthew Ratz
Member Since: 2/29/2008
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| I watched the video before you posted it here... I wanted to do a little research on my own. It tends to be helpful in a discussion. I did fail to see the "problem" I was hoping you could illuminate me.
And I am only slighty confused about the digital currency talk. This seems to be the point where we may be slipping from a reasonable discussion into full blown crazy.
I would like to point out that for thousands of years people have spoken about the end of the world and what not and for some weird reason they have been wrong every time. Here is a link about the rapture that was supposed to take place in September..... Last September..... Three months ago September.....
http://home.flash.net/~evt/rapture.htm
Awwwwwww. It does appear that they have updated the date to December 14th. I guess they wouldn't want people to think they missed the Rapture. (I think this was an episode of the Simpsons)
Playing to Win is Playing for Fun - Matthew Ratz |
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| Date Posted: 12/9/2009
Posted By: Travis Peifer
Joined before August '08
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| http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F8LPNRI_6T8
Hampton: "Can you read, my son?" Bubbles: "Well, that depends, can you go fuck yourself?" |
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| Date Posted: 12/10/2009
Posted By: Matthew Ratz
Member Since: 2/29/2008
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| Come on now Travis. this isn't helpful or relevant. I am not going to spend 2.5 hours watching a propaganda piece. I would much rather you answer my questions.
I am not in any way saying that the Fed isn't a cabal of evil. I am saying that I am not familiar with the topic, and the topic does initially sound like crazy witch-talk. I would like to learn more, and presumably you are the resident expert.
So stick to the "Fed Conspiracy" we can talk about others later.
The questsions (again)
What makes the treasuty better than the FED?
Who is "They" (The FED?)
What is the problem with global currency?
What is the problem with digital currency?
And.... not sure how this may be relevant but... What does any of this have to do with God, the mark of the beast, and armageddon in general.
Maybe you have a personal story about the FED and or governmental injustice that has affected you personally. I would definitely be interested in something like that.
Playing to Win is Playing for Fun - Matthew Ratz |
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| Date Posted: 12/14/2009
Posted By: Travis Peifer
Joined before August '08
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| 1. The Fed is a private entity not answerable to the American public, it has engineered the current economic crisis that we find ourselves.
2.“They” The Fed, Council on Foreign Relations, Trilateral Commission, Club of Rome, IMF, Council of 300, The Bilderberg Group, Skull and Bones, Illuminati, CIA,MI6, that’s a few.
3.Besides the erosion of National Sovereignty, the purpose for a global currency is to bring the world into the “New World Order”
4. Digital currency works with the RFID chip or something similar.
What does this have to do with the End of Days, everything.
And he causes all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads: And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name. Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six. - Revelations 13:16-18
BTW the rapture is bullshit, its time to separate the sheep from the goats by fire. I don’t know what your “faith” is but pray with a sincere heart to see the world as it truly is and you will know exactly what im talking bout. It’s just like the scene in the matrix. You take the blue pill and the story ends. You wake in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. You take the red pill and you stay in Wonderland and I show you how deep the rabbit-hole goes.
Hampton: "Can you read, my son?" Bubbles: "Well, that depends, can you go fuck yourself?" |
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| Date Posted: 12/14/2009
Posted By: Matthew Ratz
Member Since: 2/29/2008
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| I know what the Fed is, but you didn't answer how the treasury would be better than the Fed. I am also not clear on how they engineered the current financial crisis. I was under the impression that there was some kind of sub prime bubble burst.
How does global currency erode national sovereignty?
Do you know what an RFID chip is? because there are TONS of things that already have these. I am not sure as to what that even means. To me digital currency means all plastic. Which is both sensible and convenient.
Even while quoting the Bible... that doesn't explain at all how the previous arguments have any relation to the End of Days.
And the Rapture is Bullshit? Well I agree, but where can you draw the line on unprovable unobservable statements by man about the supernatural?
I would love to see where this rabbit hole goes, and I will continue to ask the questions until we hit the bottom.
Playing to Win is Playing for Fun - Matthew Ratz |
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| Date Posted: 1/12/2010
Posted By: Matthew Ratz
Member Since: 2/29/2008
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| So is this a bad thing too?
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Fed-posts-record-profit-of-apf-231123775.html?x=0
Playing to Win is Playing for Fun - Matthew Ratz |
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